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Wilfried Saha

Palace know without them they are as good as down given the amount of assists and goals he creates and scores. 

The window is closed and he is still their player, despite a transfer request and plenty of interest from several clubs.

In a nutshell they showed him who is in charge.

Can't help but think if only we showed as much balls (and not dollar signs) with Siggy where would we be today?
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Comments

  • edited August 8
    He refused to go on the plane. There is not much you can do when a player goes on strike and shafts their team mates and their manager like that.

    I am struck by how much anger there has been towards Andre Ayew in recent days for his apparent refusal to return to training (which turned out to be no such thing) versus the mild criticisms, or even defence, of The Liar Sigurdsson on here.

    Not having a go at you JoH (it was a fair question) but the facts are these:
    - he told fans, his team mates and the media at the player of the year event that he would only leave if the club sold him (implying, against his will)
    - he had already told the club he wanted to leave!!!
    - he refused to board the plane to the US hours before it was due to take off
    - he later claimed that he knew Everton had made a bid for him and thought that it was being accepted so there was no point him going
    - he also later claimed that his team mates and manager were fine with him not going
    - both were lies
    - Clement has gone on record as saying that he told The Liar that there was no done deal and he should travel with his team mates
    - The Liar ignored him, presumably because he wanted to (a) force the deal to go through and (b) be close to his agent so he could influence events and get what he wanted

    I presume the difference in treatment of The Liar and Andre Ayew is because The Liar scored many memorable goals for us.
    Llanjack
  • I don't dispute he was trying to force a move here Cadliegh and it appears Zaha was doing the same but my underlying impression is that we, as a club, bend over far too quickly when a player is looking to move on. Siggy is one of many examples.

    What if we stood up to his demands and bascially told him no, you're not going anywhere. We can't afford to lose you. He may well throw his toys out his pram but would he really go on stike long term? I personally have my doubts he would have done.

    The common consenus as the time is that Siggy was not worth 45m (seems cheap now) but he certainly was to us, and so it proved. The loss of him and Llorente in that window, along with their dire rerplacements, was catastrophic.


    BigGLlanjack
  • Depends how you define catastrophic. What I think you were getting at was the option to continue struggling as an also ran in the Premiership as opposed to the hugely enjoyable season we enjoyed in the Championship where no match result was a fairly bolt on certainty.
    TauntonJack
  • JoH said:
    I don't dispute he was trying to force a move here Cadliegh and it appears Zaha was doing the same but my underlying impression is that we, as a club, bend over far too quickly when a player is looking to move on. Siggy is one of many examples.

    What if we stood up to his demands and bascially told him no, you're not going anywhere. We can't afford to lose you. He may well throw his toys out his pram but would he really go on stike long term? I personally have my doubts he would have done.

    The common consenus as the time is that Siggy was not worth 45m (seems cheap now) but he certainly was to us, and so it proved. The loss of him and Llorente in that window, along with their dire rerplacements, was catastrophic.


    Common theme here is Everton. Put a decent bid in for Saha, turned his head, didn’t bother going back with another offer. Who are they playing Saturday? Oh yes, Palace.

    Turned The Liar’s head, gave him reason to burn every bridge going with his team mates, his employer, the supporters of his club. Once there was no way back for him they waited until the very last moment to conclude the deal, thereby ensuring that one more Premier League football club would not pose a threat to them in that season.

    Everton are a horrible club and I sincerely hope that they get their just desserts in my lifetime.
  • Cadleigh said:
    He refused to go on the plane. There is not much you can do when a player goes on strike and shafts their team mates and their manager like that.

    I am struck by how much anger there has been towards Andre Ayew in recent days for his apparent refusal to return to training (which turned out to be no such thing) versus the mild criticisms, or even defence, of The Liar Sigurdsson on here.

    Not having a go at you JoH (it was a fair question) but the facts are these:
    - he told fans, his team mates and the media at the player of the year event that he would only leave if the club sold him (implying, against his will)
    - he had already told the club he wanted to leave!!!
    - he refused to board the plane to the US hours before it was due to take off
    - he later claimed that he knew Everton had made a bid for him and thought that it was being accepted so there was no point him going
    - he also later claimed that his team mates and manager were fine with him not going
    - both were lies
    - Clement has gone on record as saying that he told The Liar that there was no done deal and he should travel with his team mates
    - The Liar ignored him, presumably because he wanted to (a) force the deal to go through and (b) be close to his agent so he could influence events and get what he wanted

    I presume the difference in treatment of The Liar and Andre Ayew is because The Liar scored many memorable goals for us.
    Sorry Llanjack - was that WTF you give me for that post because you think the real reason for the double standards in treatment of the Scandinavian Liar Sigurdsson v the African Andre Ayew is not actually the amount of goals they scored? How interesting? Why not actually post something to offer your thoughts rather than just snidely having a pop?
  • @Cadleigh ;

    While I'm not trying to dispute your earlier opinion, I agree with joh.

    I remember back in the summer of 2008 and all that bullshit with Derby stirring shit up in the press to try and bully our club into giving them Ferrie Bodde with no resistance. He made a transfer request which didn't help but Jenkins and Martinez stuck to their guns and it was either two million pounds or they have no interest in letting him go. Derby clearly were kept pissing about and trying every sneaky little tactic in the book with some idea that we would cave so that they could save a few hundred thousand quid.

    In the end Bodde signed a new improved contract which put that sorry saga to bed and before that tragic injury only five months later, he gave us some of the best form of his career.

    My point is that back then despite the anxiety and anger I along with other fans had towards Derby (some at Bodde too) for trying to undermine us, I used to look back at that and think how much balls our club had in handling a situation like that.

    When the Siggy saga happened that was a pathetic opposite to how our club used to handle things. We no longer played hard ball.

    You seem very certain that Siggy was sorely to blame and him alone for what happened. For me it wasn't the fact that he went and I don't even fully begrudge him for any part he played in wanting to move to another club. That happens a lot but what annoyed me the most was how our club handled the whole situation from start to finish. 

    Huw Jenkins and whoever else was involved in the transfer were far too accommodating to Everton rather than our club because as Joh says they only saw pound signs rather than worrying about letting go of an important player and not even having adequate replacement ready and waiting like we used to do in the past.

    Not only that but I felt that Jenkins and whoever else was involved were very culpable for the transfer deal dragging on and on which hurt us badly because once again all they cared about was the fucking money and not our clubs best interest.

    Finally I counter your argument that Siggy just decided not to join the team on the US tour as I remember reading an article only a few months later and it was interesting. I'm pretty sure he said something along the lines of he didn't go on the US tour because the club were worried that if he was going to Everton soon then he would have to travel back on a long journey home after only just arriving there. 

    That article confirmed what I already knew before and that was our club couldn't wait to sell him for the highest price.

    I do believe that if more competent people were in that powerful position they would have done better and tried harderto keep Siggy. Even if he does still ends up going, they'd at least have done it with the best interests of the club and not in their own personal interests.
    Jackareme
  • Could you send me a link to that article?

    The only one I can find that paints him in a good light is an interview in the Guardian that was clearly set up by his PR people when they realised he was a toxic brand because of the shameful way he treated the club, the fans and his teammates. 

    But it if you want to go on calling him ‘Siggy’ land looking back fo fondly on the greatest traitor ever to wear a Swansea shirt, that is your right.

    Does it not bother you at all though that he told the world that he would never leave the club willingly AFTER telling Clement he wanted to go? 
  • Cadleigh,
    i would prefer to not remember Gylfi as a liar but to retain memories of him as a player who played a pivotal role during our PL seasons and who was let down by our owners after Jenkins had negotiated an agreement with Everton weeks before the players returned for pre-season. The owners moved the goalposts, wanted more cash and delayed the sale, lifted two fingers to Everton, slowly ramped up the transfer fee and also delayed signing two players that meant Clement went into a new season under strength.
    As for Ferrie Bodde, are we forgetting that he was chasing new contracts and incentives on a regular basis during the short time he was with us, while have we forgotten the time when Rangel threw his toys out of the pram after the club refused to sell him to Fulham.
    Is Andre Ayew, or even his brother Jordan, mercenaries for negotiating the best deals they can from football clubs or do we feel that the main problem in all of these scenarios in a sport riddled with corruption is having people at our club totally out of their depths when negotiating with such people.
    You make your own mind up what you believe but the number of media journos you can trust can be counted on one hand.
    BigG
  • Players will try to maximise their earnings any way they can. Their playing careers are short and they are only ever a heartbeat away from a career-ending injury. That will continue to be the case whether we are managed by a former builder or a graduate from the University of Football Chairmanship, and whoever is in charge will make mistakes, as long as they have a pulse.

    The point (long lost) I was making was to ask if we are guilty of double standards in giving an easy ride to a white player (Sigurdsson) who - whatever else you may choose to believe or disbelieve) did actually lie about his intention to stay at the club - while being very critical about a black player who has actually done nothing wrong other than not scoring enough goals for us and being paid more than we would like. Thoughts?

    Like you, I am very critical of the state of our media today. This is largely down to the decisions that most posters on here (like most of the population) have taken to get their news and information for free rather than paying for it. But please don’t confuse media ownership and journalistic integrity. Last year nearly a hundred journalists were killed on the job worldwide. If you ever find yourself in Fleet Street do drop into St Bride’s, the journalists’ church. There’s a very moving memorial to them there. Closer to home there are some fine journalists writing about football, Stuart James and David Conn among them.
  • Are you suggesting that the people on here are racist Cadleigh . It reads as if you are ??? 
  • I am not accusing any one person of being racist. I am asking if we as a community are applying double standards. 
    Steve
  • Don't  think there any racists on here , I just see players as footballers  ,

    I think maybe we have more of an affection  for siggy  ( not sure if that is the right word  ) , in the fact he came on loan here first under Rodgers , did very  well , then came back in the complicated  transfer with Ben and Worm , 

    When Andre and Siggy were in the same team many saw Andre  taking up Siggy ' s  area of the pitch , and were frustrated  with him , to be fare to him he scored lots of goals . 
    Performances on the pitch Siggy was superb,  very consistent  scoring and creating  goals , always put a shift in , 

    That is my opinion  of Siggy and perhaps  why there  appears  double standards .
  • Fair comments, Malc.

    I too have fond memories of Sigurdsson scoring some amazing goals for us.

    But when I try really hard, I also remember lots of games when he didn’t show up at all. In fact there were quite long periods when he was very poor for us. But somehow I have shunted those to the back of my memory and only the spectacular goals remain front of mind. If you look back over what others have posted about him on here, I don’t think I am the only one to do this.

    Ayew, on the other hand, rarely gets a nod for his performances for us. The adjectives used about him recently include ‘fat’ and ‘lazy’.

    But if you compare their goal-scoring record for us, they are virtually identical.
  • They are 2 different  types of players Siggy out and out no. 10 ,  creative player   takes corners , free kicks , makes goals , 

    Ayew striker , out wide   in the middle , very indisciplined player , not sure where he was supposed  to play , to compare  goals scored by each   ,  unfair because they had different  roles ,

    Having seen most home games , didn't  see him go missing that often .
    barry
  • edited August 9

    Cadleigh. it's been surprising how much hate for Sigurdson you have. Also how much you want others to see what a liar he is (to change their view of him), and have even decided to call him ‘The Liar’

    My view has always been that Sigurdson was a great player for us, and I have always remembered him with good memories - I recall how well he played and how he helped us during our time at the top level.

    So with all I have read from you, I’ve actually been starting to think differently about Sigurdson. You have made it sound so accurate, that I believed you must have checked everything thoroughly before coming to your conclusions.

    I decided to double check the facts, to decide for myself what my opinion on Sigurdson should be.

    I have found that most of what you say seems accurate enough, but the main point where you have said that Sigurdson told the club he wanted to leave, before the Player of the Year awards, this is not the facts (unless you can show me differently). 

    At the Swans' Player of the Season awards night, held on the 17th May 2017, Sigurdson told reporters: “I expect to stay. I signed a new contract last summer and I’ve got three years left, so it’s down to the club if they want to sell me. It’s down to them, but I’m very happy here. I’m not trying to leave, not desperate to go or anything."- the 1st article to surface was by the BBC, 17th May 2017: https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/39956535

    Talking about Sigurdson, Paul Clement stated: "His view was that he [Sigurdson] would like the opportunity to potentially embark on another challenge. I was aware of that from the end of last season.“ This was after the final game of the 2016-17 season on May 21st 2017.

    So that is 4 days after Sigurdson had declared that he expected to stay (during them 4 days, something had occurred that caused him to change his mind). 

    You’ve said: “he told the world that he would never leave the club willingly AFTER telling Clement he wanted to go”  “he had already told the club he wanted to leave!!!”

    So for me, it seems like Everton must have made him an offer during the 4 days that did completely turn his head. 

    I won’t be going down the ‘I hate Sigurdsson route’, he was a great player and I will always remember him without any bad thoughts. He was, and will always be a true Swans legend to me.


  • What Sigurdson said at the Swans' Player of the Season and Players' Player of the Season awards, 17th May 2017.

    Sigurdson told Swansea fans at their club's end of season awards night: “I expect to stay. I signed a new contract last summer and I’ve got three years left, so it’s down to the club if they want to sell me. It’s down to them, but I’m very happy here.

    “I’m not trying to leave, not desperate to go or anything. It’s not like I want to go, it’s just very calm and I’m not focused or concentrating on what people are writing.

    “I’ve always been happy here and you only have to look at the coaching staff who came in to see there are good things happening here. They’re top notch and Paul Clement knows what he’s doing.”

    “It doesn’t bother me what people are talking about. It’s been easy in the last couple of months because we’ve been in a very serious position in the league, so it’s been easy to concentrate on that.

    "I think it’ll continue to be like that because whatever happens, happens.

    “As I said, I’m happy here; I’ve played a lot of football and the goals and the assists have been coming for last three years. We’ve played some good football apart from maybe a year and a half. Things haven’t been going well as I have liked but I have still enjoyed the pressure of being in this situation.

    “We’re happy it’s finished and we’re safe. It didn’t look good around Christmas time, not going to lie, so to be safe with a game to go is a very good feeling.”

    liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/everton-blow-gylfi-sigurdsson-deal-


  • rob_h said:

    What Sigurdson said at the Swans' Player of the Season and Players' Player of the Season awards, 17th May 2017.

    Sigurdson told Swansea fans at their club's end of season awards night: “I expect to stay. I signed a new contract last summer and I’ve got three years left, so it’s down to the club if they want to sell me. It’s down to them, but I’m very happy here.

    “I’m not trying to leave, not desperate to go or anything. It’s not like I want to go, it’s just very calm and I’m not focused or concentrating on what people are writing.

    “I’ve always been happy here and you only have to look at the coaching staff who came in to see there are good things happening here. They’re top notch and Paul Clement knows what he’s doing.”

    “It doesn’t bother me what people are talking about. It’s been easy in the last couple of months because we’ve been in a very serious position in the league, so it’s been easy to concentrate on that.

    "I think it’ll continue to be like that because whatever happens, happens.

    “As I said, I’m happy here; I’ve played a lot of football and the goals and the assists have been coming for last three years. We’ve played some good football apart from maybe a year and a half. Things haven’t been going well as I have liked but I have still enjoyed the pressure of being in this situation.

    “We’re happy it’s finished and we’re safe. It didn’t look good around Christmas time, not going to lie, so to be safe with a game to go is a very good feeling.”

    liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/everton-blow-gylfi-sigurdsson-deal-


    Sorry Rob, Siggurdsson told Clement he wanted to go after the Sunderland match on 13 May. No doubt this wasn't a spur of the moment decision, he had clearly been contemplating it for a while: "the Iceland international admits he discussed a move away from the Liberty with Clement and other Swansea club officials after they had secured their Premier League safety on the penultimate weekend of the previous campaign." (https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/gylfi-sigurdsson-reveals-decided-wanted-13496792)

    That was four days before he lied to us fans at the Player of the Season awards.
  • edited August 9
    That is interesting.

    But have you got a link that clearly shows that is exactly what Sigurdson said?

    The article states: "And the Iceland international admits he discussed a move away from the Liberty with Clement and other Swansea club officials after they had secured their Premier League safety on the penultimate weekend of the previous campaign."

    But this was written by Ian Mitchelmore, it isn't what Sigurdson said, that could be Mitchelmores interpretation. Unless I can have a link to exactly what Sigurdson said, it could be just hearsay (would not stand up in court as evidence).

    Have you got anything showing that Sigurdson actually said it was "on the penultimate weekend"?


  • What Clement said about Sigurdson:

    "I made it clear to Gylfi at the end of last season and conversations I had via texts with him over the summer that I would like him to stay,'' Clement said.

    "His view was that he would like the opportunity to potentially embark on another challenge.

    "I was aware of that from the end of last season. The conversations were open and frank, but you still hope there might be a change of mind.

    "It might have been: 'The fans want you here, the owners want you here, I want you here' and the answer could have been 'Okay, I'll stay.' But that wasn't the case.''

    Whren Swansea were leaving for a tour of the United States 13th July 2017, Sigurdsson  told Clement at breakfast that he would not be travelling to America with Everton keen to sign him.

    "I said to Gylfi my opinion was that he should still come to America,'' Clement said.

    "It could have potentially fallen through. He was confident it wouldn't and he decided to stay.

    "We know what happened then, it didn't go through. It has now.

    "It has gone on longer than we would have liked, but sometimes these deals are complicated.''

    Asked if he was surprised that Sigurdsson chose to pull out of the American tour, Clement replied: "I was. We were in London on our way and I believed he was coming.

    "I don't know why he came up with that.

    "Clearly he was speaking to his representatives who were confident that it would happen then. But it didn't.''

    https://www.espn.co.uk/football/swansea-city/story/3182397/gylfi-sigurdsson-told-swansea-he-wanted-to-leave-last-season-paul-clement


  • Who said what and when is (at least to me) totally irrelevant - Footballers have a limited career and it is their duty to maximise their return on their god given talent for the benefit of themselves and their family. NOTE sometimes happiness and lifestyle are more important commodities than money -  to some more than others.
    I will NEVER think badly of Siggy, Roberto etc. as often things are said (and quotes taken) in the heat of the moment - and also twisted entirely out of context.
    My beef with the whole Siggy thing echoes the excellent post above from @Jack_14_Army. We are and always have been a selling club. The difference is making sure that sales are on your terms, playing hardball, and having a plan for the next player up in that position. Football is not modern day slavery, players are entitled to leave and better themselves, and we are naïve in the extreme, if we see our beloved Swans as the pinnacle of professional achievement. 
    We would have been cool with Siggy going IF (a) the price was right (b) we had half a clue as to a succession plan (c) the business had been conducted early enough to avoid impacting our pre season preparations.
    Unfortunately negligence on a royal scale meant that two of the three above criteria were ignored and we found ourselves in a pickle.
    Siggy wanting to leave and exiting the club was never a surprise, so why the club reacted as if it were is a mystery.

    I have a high level of confidence that Birch Cooper and Scott will be having the conversations with each player on and ongoing basis, and have contingency plans in place for every position should somebody either (a) want to leave or (b) we get an offer that makes business sense for the club (too good to refuse).
    This is what a professional football club looks like - and is a million miles from the complacent, make it up as you go along approach of Huw and our leadership team over the last 4-5 years of his tenure. 
    A toxic mix of vanity and greed - but I personally have nothing but gratitude and respect for Siggy!
    rob_hITK
  • Thanks Rob. It is clear from the context of the article that Mitchelmore got to interview Siggurdsson (as opposed to rehashing something that had already appeared somewhere else). If Siggurdsson was unhappy with what Mitchelmore said he said, you can bet his PR minder would have demanded it was changed. And the beauty of the world wide web is that mistakes can be corrected at the press of a button. So we can be confident that Mitchelmore got it right, and Siggurdsson told Clement that he was intending to go before the Player of the Year dinner. 

    It’s interesting how Clement’s account above contradicts Siggurdsson’s version which he gave in an interview with the Guardian (https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/football/2017/aug/18/football-premier-league-everton-swansea-gylfi-sigurdsson). In it he says “Of course it was a difficult decision [not to go on the US tour]. I had a close relationship not just with the team but with the manager. I really respect him. But we all just thought it was that close to being done. I think both clubs, myself and the manager and the team decided for me to stay back.” Either he is lying or Clement is. Since Clement has nothing to gain from lying whereas Siggurdsson took a fair amount of flak for refusing to travel, I know who I think is lying. 

    Genuinely sorry if this has spoiled your memories. He was one of my favourite ever Swans players, so I understand how you feel.
  • edited August 9
    Good post Jackareme.

    For me, what this clearly shows is how early the club were aware of Everton's interest, and of Siggy's head being turned. Then how badly they dealt with the whole situation. 

    With the new team we have Birch, Cooper, Britton, Scott. Being ready for any player leaving, and having new players identified, to get things done quickly must now become a priority. Bedding in new players early and having a good pre-season can have a really positive effect on the season. 

    At some point Everton made Siggy an offer that was so good he decided to potentially embark on another challenge. 

    I don't have any bad feeling towards Siggy or Martinez, all players want to better themselves and earn as much as they can, and most managers will want to manage at the highest division they can.


    Jackareme
  • There isn’t any ambiguity about any of this. The season before, there was interest in Siggurdsson. The board said we are not selling, end of. Very clear strategy. And the right one IMO.

    Siggurdsson decided he did want to go, and told his manager on 14 May. Then on 17 May he told supporters he would only leave if the club sold him.

    At the start of the season Everton made an offer. The board executed their strategy - they said he is not for sale. Then Siggurdsson forced the issue by refusing to go on the pre-season tour, despite his manager pleading with him. From that point onwards, it was clear that the strategy had failed and they would have to go to plan b - sell him for as much as possible. 

    Turning this on in its head and blaming the board is a really weird reversal of responsibility.

    i don’t deny that players have a right to move clubs and say stupid things. Where I draw the line is when they lie to fans and withdraw their labour to get what they want.

    Tell me - what do you think of Jordan Ayew insisting he wouldn’t accept a transfer without a pay increase, which ultimately cost us £2.5 million? In my book that is less serious than refusing to go on pre-season tour with your team-mates. Do you think that was OK behaviour too? What if André Ayew had refused to turn up for training in order to get the move he wanted, as some on here believed he had? Also OK? 
  • Everton were after him the previous summer and had the bid turned down by the board so it didn’t come as a shock that they came back a year later with another offer which the club said was too low at first and they agreed on the £45 mill figure late on . And as for Siggy getting a nest egg for his future he already is a wealthy man as his family own a fish business in Iceland 
  • edited August 9

    Cheers Cadleigh. I have to say it does imply Sigurdson informed him this, and if it was incorrect his PR advisor could have demanded it was changed. 

    But how often do you hear of people giving interviews and finding out things written were not quite accurate, then being furious about it.

    If you look at what Mitchelmore has said, it is actually accurate, if Sigurdson had first mentioned it to Clement after the season (as Clement has stated), Mitchelmore saying it was after Swansea had secured Premier League safety on the penultimate weekend of the previous campaign is not inaccurate. He just does not mention how long afterwards it was.

    [We had secured Premier League safety on the penultimate weekend, this is correct]

    I have written to Ian Mitchelmore to find out for sure if Sigurdson definitely told Clement he was open to exploring his options, on the Penultimate day of that season (or if it was after, how many days after).

    You are correct that Siggy could have gone on social media and corrected this information, and this is a very good point. But it may be that he has completely had enough of it all and could not be bothered any longer.

    So for me to say, yes I now believe 100% that Sigurdsson is a liar, unless Ian Mitchelmore can confirm to me what he wrote is the truth. I will stick with my good memories of Siggy for now.

    The only real facts we have at the moment are what Clement and Sigurdson have said:

    Clement: “I was aware of that from the end of last season”


    Sigurdson: "I think me, Paul and all of the staff had a really good relationship. We always talked directly to one another, there was no going behind each other's backs or anything, we always had honest conversations. After a very difficult season last year, it was possible for me to have a chance to look somewhere else.”
  • Cadleigh said:
    There isn’t any ambiguity about any of this. The season before, there was interest in Siggurdsson. The board said we are not selling, end of. Very clear strategy. And the right one IMO.

    Siggurdsson decided he did want to go, and told his manager on 14 May. Then on 17 May he told supporters he would only leave if the club sold him.

    At the start of the season Everton made an offer. The board executed their strategy - they said he is not for sale. Then Siggurdsson forced the issue by refusing to go on the pre-season tour, despite his manager pleading with him. From that point onwards, it was clear that the strategy had failed and they would have to go to plan b - sell him for as much as possible. 

    Turning this on in its head and blaming the board is a really weird reversal of responsibility.

    i don’t deny that players have a right to move clubs and say stupid things. Where I draw the line is when they lie to fans and withdraw their labour to get what they want.

    Tell me - what do you think of Jordan Ayew insisting he wouldn’t accept a transfer without a pay increase, which ultimately cost us £2.5 million? In my book that is less serious than refusing to go on pre-season tour with your team-mates. Do you think that was OK behaviour too? What if André Ayew had refused to turn up for training in order to get the move he wanted, as some on here believed he had? Also OK? 
    Fair enough @Cadleigh ; - however, the blaming of the Board (at least from me) is little/nothing to do with the points you make, and I am certainly not wanting to rewrite history - BUT every player at all times is a potential flight risk at a club like ours, and while they dug their hells in and held out for top dollar there was neither (a) any thought as to a replacement in the No.10 position (which haunted us for the next few seasons (b) no recognition of the damage their mule like behaviour caused to preparations and morale. Unforgiveable. 
  • Cadleigh,
    there was ambiguity, double talk in so many things around the Gylfi transfer to Everton. What can be said about the common knowledge in and around the city in June, way before the plane to the USA that Jenkins had agreed a deal with Everton for around £25M. Fans were disappointed to see Gylfi go but at least most fans felt that it was a good deal. Was Gylfi's refusal to board the plane the time when our owners stepped in and told Everton they wanted more cash.
    Llanjackrob_h
  • Cadleigh,
    there was ambiguity, double talk in so many things around the Gylfi transfer to Everton. What can be said about the common knowledge in and around the city in June, way before the plane to the USA that Jenkins had agreed a deal with Everton for around £25M. Fans were disappointed to see Gylfi go but at least most fans felt that it was a good deal. Was Gylfi's refusal to board the plane the time when our owners stepped in and told Everton they wanted more cash.

    Sigurdson was sure the deal was about to go through. He informed Clement at breakfast he would not travel to America, because Everton keen to sign him.

    "I said to Gylfi my opinion was that he should still come to America,'' Clement said.

    "It could have potentially fallen through. He was confident it wouldn't and he decided to stay. Clearly he was speaking to his representatives who were confident that it would happen then. But it didn't."

  • Jackareme said:
    Cadleigh said:
    There isn’t any ambiguity about any of this. The season before, there was interest in Siggurdsson. The board said we are not selling, end of. Very clear strategy. And the right one IMO.

    Siggurdsson decided he did want to go, and told his manager on 14 May. Then on 17 May he told supporters he would only leave if the club sold him.

    At the start of the season Everton made an offer. The board executed their strategy - they said he is not for sale. Then Siggurdsson forced the issue by refusing to go on the pre-season tour, despite his manager pleading with him. From that point onwards, it was clear that the strategy had failed and they would have to go to plan b - sell him for as much as possible. 

    Turning this on in its head and blaming the board is a really weird reversal of responsibility.

    i don’t deny that players have a right to move clubs and say stupid things. Where I draw the line is when they lie to fans and withdraw their labour to get what they want.

    Tell me - what do you think of Jordan Ayew insisting he wouldn’t accept a transfer without a pay increase, which ultimately cost us £2.5 million? In my book that is less serious than refusing to go on pre-season tour with your team-mates. Do you think that was OK behaviour too? What if André Ayew had refused to turn up for training in order to get the move he wanted, as some on here believed he had? Also OK? 
    Fair enough @Cadleigh ; - however, the blaming of the Board (at least from me) is little/nothing to do with the points you make, and I am certainly not wanting to rewrite history - BUT every player at all times is a potential flight risk at a club like ours, and while they dug their hells in and held out for top dollar there was neither (a) any thought as to a replacement in the No.10 position (which haunted us for the next few seasons (b) no recognition of the damage their mule like behaviour caused to preparations and morale. Unforgiveable. 
    Again, I am left wondering whether people think they should have let Siggurdsson go more cheaply. With hindsight we can see that the manager wasn’t able to spend the money on the kind of player needed. But not all clubs have a Siggurdsson type player at no10. We haven’t always had one. Arguably we haven’t now - Celina shares some of his distribution skills but not his dead ball ability. And when we have tried to replace like for like (Mesa for Britton) it has often failed. So I won’t criticise the manager for opting for a different approach to replace Siggurdsson and Llorente, or the board for insisting that Everton pay what he was worth. 

    It was Everton who shafted us by waiting til the last moment to pay what they knew they had to pay, and I believe it was a deliberate tactic to hurt a smaller club. 
  • Cadleigh,
    there was ambiguity, double talk in so many things around the Gylfi transfer to Everton. What can be said about the common knowledge in and around the city in June, way before the plane to the USA that Jenkins had agreed a deal with Everton for around £25M. Fans were disappointed to see Gylfi go but at least most fans felt that it was a good deal. Was Gylfi's refusal to board the plane the time when our owners stepped in and told Everton they wanted more cash.
    I don’t know a single person who thought £25 was a good deal for Siggurdssson. Be interesting to go back to the Guestbook for that period and see what people were saying then. Is it still available?
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